Laduma Ngxokolo

Bruce Whitfield: It all starts in the Eastern Cape when your mom teaches you to knit. Now, for little boys or young men to learn to knit... I was taught as a seven-year-old to knit and a kid from another class found my knitting and I never needed again. That fate didn't befall you.

Yeah. I had sort of the same experience as well. I learned how to knit when I was in grade 8, but prior to that I used to do beadwork, crochet with my late mother. The knitting was more technical. It was a small piece of machine, a domestic knitting machine. That is what fascinated me more, is that I could use the machine at home in my room and make a fabric and make a full garment. But, I kept it a secret for all of my high school year. It is only when I went out of high school that I announce that oh, I'm a knitter. I'm going to study textile design and Technology as a degree.                               

Bruce Whitfield: Your mom was a knitwear designer. Tell me her story.

Yes. She was back in the 80s in Port Elizabeth. She had a small studio in small town, New Brighton and she had a small clientele in her community. She seemed to be a person that did it as an impulsive skill because the minute she got married, she let it roll off and became a housewife. Unfortunately, she couldn't elevate on that part in it because of the political circumstances at the time. But, she seemed to be very good at it. Actually, later in my years at University, I came across an Afrikaans lady 80-something years old and I told it that I'm a knitter and she was a tutor at the University and apparently she told my mother how to knit and became my mentor. 

Bruce Whitfield: Your mum was clearly the inspiration. You were clearly artistic as a youngster, you were doing the beadwork and stuff again, very traditional but you were not making any money from it at that stage or were you?

Primary School level I wasn’t making money out of it. It was more impulsive. I guess, I was good at it because I was patient, more patient than other siblings. They practice craft as well but took my time and started beading from start to finish with the crochet needle. I started making money when the pressure was on because my late mother taught me how to knit at the beginning of the year, in Grade 8. Later that year she passed away. So, we had to think of ways as a child-headed home of raising money for bread, for bus fare and all the other resources that we need for school. And so I sold scarves at school. I went to Lawsonburn high school. So, the school shop was my competitor.

Bruce Whitfield: There was a passion led by your own desire to design but your mum enabled you and empowered you with the skill, and then the necessity bred the desire for survival and created the basis of what is now a great business.

Yeah, not only the skills part, she was entrepreneur herself. I don't remember her going to work. She used to fetch us it school on a daily basis, all four of us and I had to beg her not to fetch me anymore in high school. She was a different thinker. So, to adopt being an entrepreneur wasn't something that was challenging for me. It came naturally. So I knew that there is the ultimate direction that I wanted to follow in life and it became a passion, it didn't feel like work anymore.

Bruce Whitfield: Did your education teach you anything? I mean beyond some technical skills because some people are born creative and have skill sets and, sometimes education stifles their creativity.

 Yeah, when I finish my matric I had to make a very tough decision. I got depressed during my matric because I was questioning a lot, you know things, you know, whether what my purpose is and where to push my career direction and I ultimately decided okay, I think let me elevate my skill and then and enhance it with education. I thought at a time, if I didn't infuse education, I could only hit the ceiling, which is my hometown. I couldn't go beyond and then distributed nationally, across the continent and offshore so that helped me a lot, you know, because I learned how to formalize my business, basically with all the academic knowledge that I accumulated.

Bruce Whitfield: You graduated from what many people would refer to the University of Port Elizabeth then became the Nelson Mandela Metropolitan University now Nelson Mandela University. You graduate and at that point, do you know that you're going to take traditional Xhosa designs inspired-Xhosa designs? Is that the aim?  Is that the aim when you start out?

I had no idea at all, to be honest. I only had the experience of immersing myself in Xhosa anthropology when I was growing up with our mother, reading Xhosa anthropology books to us as bedtime stories. And, then I reconnected with that after my initiation procedure which I was in 2007 because I became more curious, you know as who I come from, because I was disconnected with our father. I wanted to know more about where my family lineage comes from. So, I did a lot of research about Xhosa beadwork throughout University until it came to a time in 2010 when I found the thesis project where I tried to discover how traditional Xhosa beadwork can be used to make knitwear, modern knitwear for Xhosa initiates.

Bruce Whitfield: What is the origin of the beadwork? Xhosa people were doing beadwork for centuries, lots of traditions, the tradition with clay and ceremony and, all of this stuff which is deeply embedded in your heritage. To then take that and adapt it for a 21st century. What motivated you to do that?

My thought process was centered around identity. We as the youth, millennials, I felt like the type of identity that we adopted wasn't really ours. Buying jerseys that are prints of Scotland, motifs felt to me personally, as a fashion design, as a textile designer that is it is a borrowed culture. So it was sort of like borrowed power that would often be taken away. So I thought okay, let me discover something that would resonate with us, that will celebrate us, that will acknowledge our past and I stumbled upon a collection of astonishing beadwork I think hypothetically, are the most beautiful beadwork you'd find in the world.

Bruce Whitfield: What was it from a particular place, was a particular time in history. What was that particular moment? 

Some of those beadwork pieces were from the 1800s. Most of the beads were bought from traders who were scattered in the Eastern Cape. I researched and found out that these beads actually, course I wondered how the manufacturing of these beats come about. According to anthropology, these were manufactured mainly in Czech Republic. And, the Dutch and the English, they were traders of these beads and used to sell them locally within the Eastern Cape and in the absence of currency, people even used cows to trade with these beads. But what fascinated me is the Artistry that these women came up with, you know.

Bruce Whitfield: Because before settler times, before the traders came, those beads wouldn't have existed. So, how will people expressing themselves before beads because they must have been an evolution and then into textiles.

According to anthropology people were using bones. They used to refine bones and use bones as beadwork, they used shells and various other minerals, but those were not as flamboyant and very well-crafted as beads.

Bruce Whitfield: And, harder to work with.                         

Yeah, I can imagine it was super hard to work with. I've often seen those references from the Khoisan and then thought they if they still capture that primitive appeal but with the Xhosa, they’ve evolved but it is so interesting that through human history.

Bruce Whitfield: We've sought to beautify and enhance our environments we take things from my environment. We beautify and enhance those and create beautiful things. Yeah, you've taken that history and you've now evolved it into textiles how much of a shift is that?

I think is a great shift because my methods involves technology the spin-off possibilities are much wider. Like I can take one design and spin it off in ten colour ways within an hour. I can take one Motif or ten motifs and spin-off like thousand designs, you know. So it became infinite, the transition from beadwork to textiles and for me, I felt like I needed to acknowledge the initial craftsmanship and graphic imprint. Hence. I decided to call the brand MaXhosa, which means the Xhosa people according to my perspective.

Bruce Whitfield: So if you look at globalized fashion, and we look at Armani and you look at Pringle and you look at Gap, for example, they focused on simplicity and they're focused on the basics and they've made bleeding fortunes over decades. What you do is about as far away from basic simplicity as you can possibly get, quite from a business perspective quite high risk or not.

Our DNA is our currency our simplicity of cause he's is what we want to achieve over time, but not compromising what we represent. For instance, I'm wearing a golf shirt as we speak now.

Bruce Whitfield: You’re wearing a golf shirt. It is primarily red, but it has diamond shapes on it the top sort of third of the golf shirt is a beautiful sky blue diamond pattern. There is a white zigzag. Then the bottom third is dominated by the pink zigzag and diamond pattern. The sleeves are the same color. I think yes. These are our dark maybe dark brown or black with traditional classic Motif on it and then sort of finished off with one with a pink edging and the other sleeve with a yellow edging and on the middle of this shirt is a blue. What we what do you call the button up bit of the golf shirt? The button stand. and a black collar. Now, nobody in global fashion would have put that together would have ever envisaged putting all of those designs together in one.

Hence,  I say it is our DNA, it is our currency. So, we have explored simple ideas, you know, which is a special request from our corporate clientele that want to wear something that they can wear at work on a daily basis, but have a touch of my course. So we've recently launched a golf shirt range, which has embossed patterns. So the patterns are not colorful the embossed you can still see them as 3D patterns. And of course a trimming on the cuffs and pattern on the collar is what we cannot take out. And so that is that detail is still there because we're thinking about those people that don't want to stand out but, yet want to make a statement.

Bruce Whitfield: What's so interesting about fashion, is once you produce what you produce and you put it into the market, different groups appropriate that design. Burberry had a problem at one stage, where suddenly, not their traditional market, the so-called chavs decided Burberry was cool and Burberry's brand was undermined almost by the huge market people they never thought would buy their stuff. Suddenly buying it, suddenly it was no longer Elite, it was footballers. And, they lost control of the brand, well their understanding of the brand. How do you feel about putting your work, your culture, your tradition, everything that you stand for into a market of which have no control.

I prefer that actually than confining my work within my premises. I like throwing ideas out there to the market and try to get public opinion of what people think. When I first got here in Johannesburg, I spent a while working at our retail store because I wanted to hear people's feedback on what suggestions they have and that simple golf shirt, conservative golf shirt was one of those suggestions that came from customers. People have used our comments in a way in that we never expected as well. And we've attracted the clienteles and clientele that we never anticipated. Arabs and Indians, I never imagined that they would adorn themselves in this MaXhosa pieces as well.

Bruce Whitfield: What MaXhosa means for you doesn't necessarily have any meaning for your customer. Does that worry you at all or are you just happy with the fact that they're willing to take your design without any understanding of its background and the blood, the sweat and the tears and the hundreds of years of tradition that then formed it.

I always try my best to share the compelling story before the work, but first of all, what attracts the customers is the beauty, it’s how we put colour together, how we balance it and how we simplify it and then the compelling story, it comes after and then people get to appreciate the price more than say that actually this should be much I was I expect to pay much more than I did. Purchasing user journey doesn't end from a person paying and getting the product, you know. So we try to get on platforms where we can share our story.

Bruce Whitfield: Your intellectual property is your intellectual property and, you recently butted heads with a global multi-national. Like so many stories like this, you get a call one day - saying hey, you've got your socks here XY is it store and you go. No, I don't. Tell us the tale.

I got an Instagram direct message from a friend who lives in London and said, hey, do you have a collaboration with this global entity? And I said no, and then someone from New York came, sent a DM as well and someone from Sandton sent a DM as well and I thought okay, now it's a problem. I looked online. It was also online, in Germany and various parts of the world and I thought okay, it is time to take action because it does affect our sales in a way.

Bruce Whitfield: But, beyond that. It's outright theft of your intellectual property, this was your sock design. It was specifically socks as I remember, specifically socks your sock next to the sock of the multi-national retailer and there was absolutely nothing to choose between the two from a design perspective.

Yeah. It was a carbon copy of what we did 3 years ago. Fortunately, we seeked legal remedy and we found a solution of how we as both parties can meet halfway and they were submissive and they pulled out the products globally as soon as people made a hoohaa on social media. And, they sincerely asked to settle out of court and we’re in the process of concluding that matter.

Bruce Whitfield: As awful an experience as that was, it must also have been a very eye-opening experience to say, hold on a second, here is a mainstream retailer that is taking our designs, making the mainstream - lightbulb moment, opportunity moment. Actually, if you look at the upside of it.

Yeah. It was an awakening moment because for a long time now local people thought that we are secondary market, you know, we only get to see new collections after three years after two years. Whereas now, we are becoming a source of inspiration. Well for the high-end fashion houses, we have been becoming but they take from traditional cultural aesthetic which has no sense of belonging or IP belonging to someone. So, they just happened to tap on the wrong foot this time because I had documents to prove that.

Bruce Whitfield: There’s taking inspiration and there’s theft and, this was intellectual property theft which they have admitted in court,  what happens now to MaXhosa? What is the brand journey of MaXhosa now? You’re well-established, you’ve got yourself global attention courtesy of plagiarism. You can capitalize on this opportunity.

Yeah. Absolutely. Our journey now is our first stage is to expand more locally. We've had a lot of requests coming from Durban people want to purchase our products there. We have we've come up with solutions for Paulo Silva that Hometown we've been in Cape Town for years now and been here in trouble for years and we are expanding in Nigeria.               

Kenya I've always felt that African Market is there is our priority Market people often have a misconception that we prioritized overseas market and think that it has higher volumes were as we move much volumes locally, but other than that, we are expanding our portfolio and we've we've gone as far as making iPhone cases.

Bruce Whitfield: It's a wooden iPhone case but with beadwork, I mean it's so distinctly MaXhosa, I mean that is that is almost the trademark of MaXhosa. You see that, you think MaXhosa brand immediately.

Absolutely and we've penetrated steadily in the luxury markets as well. Most of our customers think of us and as an alternative to Gucci Brands Louis Vuitton and various other pool of luxury Brands.

Bruce Whitfield: And that's the market to play it because the margins are good years, opportunities are good. Tell me about DJ black coffee. I mean the more I talk about this guy the more I realize how invested he is in so many really interesting ventures across our country.

Now, he's a very brilliant and entrepreneur, brave and willing person to take risks the latest that we've that I've done with him along with Nelson Mogambo, who has his artwork on the cover of current Time Magazine. We started an initiative called fam fashion art music we recently bought a building where we've housed all our studios in the long-term plan is to establish a higher education institutions what we realized actually when we met the three of us, the initial idea was to was what was to do a collaboration for black office CD cover and there was in the result.

Bruce Whitfield: It's amazing how those conversations evolved. You’ve got three creative people around the table is like, okay, we got to do the CD cover and suddenly you’re not talking about the CD cover anymore, you’re talking about the world.

We discovered that we had something in common in all three of us. We are successful in our in our field and went to University and didn't accumulate that the business Acumen from that rather from the playing field. We thought that the business Acumen side of design and music and art should be standard part of the curriculum. And so I just happened to go to have the opportunity to study at the best fashion university in the world the central Saint Martin's in London. I wanted to take that experience here at home and establish at the best institution in Africa and the world because we've got tremendous talent in the continent but it a lot of it is limited by resources.

Bruce Whitfield: What do you time frames?

We looking at two year time frame to get a curriculum sorted and Mr. David Medusa. Our Premier has also committed to be a strong form of support for us within the resources they have within the province.

Bruce Whitfield: So much of this is also helped be funded with collaborations with corporate clients. You worked with the likes of the Sanlam and the Chivas of the world even Nivea in helping create brand identities and helping enhance brand identities.

Yeah. Yeah that has helped elevates and gain visibility of our brand a lot those collaborations were way with very much based on pushing communion development with the she was one. I did a great project. I did all the cities and did a workshop of about 50 emerging designers. There was a very            

I'm journey and something that direction that I like taking with Brands and making something that has impact to society.

Bruce Whitfield: Do put yourself in the shoes of those young designers and say gee, I wish somebody had done this 15 years.

 Yes. Yes. Yes. Absolutely. I wish I had that luck. Unfortunately the announcement the university offered me that platform where they established a new to Beta I was a guinea pig, the first incubatee of that program, but not only high level like I did it to them. I've even gone as far as opening up an Eastern Cape fashion and design counsel.

Bruce Whitfield: The Eastern Cape is such a frustrating province from the point of view of the extraordinary potential and it's just been so neglected as a part of our country. It's historically in the last hundred and fifty years. Lots of people have migrated from there for work and societies haven't worked out. And it's just not had the investment. It's required. So by putting money back in mmm help to grow a province with a very rich cultural heritage massively diverse in terms of opportunity from designed to tourism to so much other good stuff that can happen in that part of the world and you're investing back.

Yeah. I felt like I had to cause Edie's and emergency Society especially in the youth unemployment site. So last week I was there to speak at the Nelson Mandela University and to speak at the Nelson Mandela Metropolitan Art Museum and signed up a few other members to the truth to the counseling because that is how I am able to commit on Community Development work through an NPO basically, so we had a donation from the MEC of the Eastern Cape who said please create three other Ladumas with the funding that you are giving you so that has been very defining moment.

Bruce Whitfield: Do you pinch yourself sometimes and you go here's this kid from New Brighton whose mum taught him to knit when he was in grade 8 and got a break and went to University and made that choice to get into design, hit on an idea with global potential that can have local impact.

 I do honestly, one of the most defining moments where her pinch myself was got invited to speak next month at the CondeNast conference, which is the first luxury conference in Africa and amongst those speakers. I'll be speaking with the CEO of Gucci, the environmental CEO of Louis Vuitton group the PS Group chairman the Cardinals chairman and all the top dogs are among that list and Hannelie Rupert and Doctor Pratrice Motsepe, I'm the youngest in panel and the only black guy, you know. So I thought wow, if I hadn't I'd taken that decision seven years ago, I don't think I would have been there at all.

Bruce Whitfield: The incredible story of Laduma Ngxokolo, who is the founder of MaXhosa by Laduma, taking the global stage by storm.